Bigfoot Screams Heard in Cloudcroft, NM
TBRC Report given by Sharon Eby & Dr. Bruce Cornet
Sharon Eby is the TBRC West Regional Leader & Dr. Bruce Cornet is the Deputy Administrator of NIDS. They both interviewed the witnesses in their current respective locations for this compiled report. (NOTE: This was in 2004 and titles are no longer applicable)
PART I - INTERVIEW REPORT by Sharon Eby (Cornet)
April 11, 2004 (Interview with witness Hector Valles on Thurs, April 8) I spoke with the witness, Hector Valles, here in El Paso at his place of residence. The story of his and his friend Edgar Ramos hearing the screams of what they (he) believed to be a bigfoot creature was exactly as he had submitted on his original online sighting report last October. I did find out more details, however, including obtaining a map of the area with the exact location of the occurrence, as well as a hand-drawn map of the campground area and the direction that the creature came from and moved towards. I will make these maps available for the final report.
A correction by Hector regarding the date of the sighting was given to me as Summer (mid-July) of 1995, rather than 1996. The time of the sighting was anywhere from 11pm to 1am, he is unsure of just where in there it happened. The weather was clear, dry, and the evenings were cool enough up in the mountains to need a jacket. Sighting occurred in Lincoln County, NM. The area is wooded (although thinly within the campground itself), and the grounds were nestled between two hills in a more flat area at the bottom. Mountains and hills surround the area, and are heavily wooded with pine trees, etc. Hector was unsure of any caves, mines, or abandoned shelters in the area at all. In the campground there was a hand water pump and a puddle beneath it but he was not aware of any bodies of water outside of the campground. No bigfoot creature was seen by Hector, and he said his friend Edgar did not see it either, they only heard it screaming (Hector showed me a sound byte from the BFRO website ( http://www.bfro.net/AVEVID/MJM/Howl.mp3 ) which still sends chills up his spine and that reminded him a LOT of the screams he and Edgar heard that night). They were awakened from within their tent in the night by a screaming in the distance that sounded like a cross between a woman and a baby. Hector stated that the sounds continued, with pauses in between, from very far in the distance, until they came closer, and into the campground. He (they) could tell that the creature was not human, nor did it sound like any animal they had ever heard before (their first thought was that it was a bear, except that bears did NOT make that kind of noise!). The creature, they thought, was walking through the campground checking out the 4 spots or so where campers were at, and possibly foraging for food. The creature got to their camp and stood near the fire pit, or between the fire pit and their tent. Total distance was estimated to be at approximately 20 to 25 feet away from the tent. The creature continued to scream and pause, grunting and sounding like it was sniffing in the pauses. Then it would scream LOUD again and it started to walk off into the forest. The witnesses dared not poke their heads out of the tent because of the fear of possible danger. The only weapon they had was a hammer, which they held onto tightly, just in case.
They could hear the creature walk away from their tent and by the time it got far enough away they could no longer hear it they were finally able to settle down and get some sleep. Estimated time from the first screams they heard until the last screams they heard were approximately 10-15 minutes, which indicates that the being was able to travel quite fast. The creature seemed to know exactly where it was going. Hector and Edgar got up the next morning and looked for tracks, but none were found.
End of Report Part I (Part II - Interview with Edgar Ramos continues below...)
ADDITIONAL STORIES GIVEN BY HECTOR VALLES:
Hector Valles remembers being at a party once in May of 1985 at the Tom Mays State Park on the west side of the Franklin Mountains in El Paso, TX. He got together with a bunch of friends to drink beer and talk and hang out. After a few beers they got into a deep discussion about God, one of their friends not believing in such. They would walk up the hill to go to the bathroom, but Hector had an ominous feeling and so went downhill instead, where his friends could see him in case anything should happen. Two friends (one who believed in God) and another, named Norma, went up the hill when it was their turn to go to the bathroom... he went left and she went right. After a little bit they came back saying, "Get out of here!" The guy was pale looking, even in the moonlight. Neither he nor Norma wanted to talk about what had happened. The next week the man admitted to seeing a "tall humanoid" that was "furry" hovering over Norma, but she didn't see anything, although she could FEEL it's breath behind her. It scared them both very much.
Another story Hector Valles has relayed was about two friends of his who are married. They recently went to Hector's house and he showed them the sound byte of the bigfoot scream from the BFRO website. The woman, Pati, listened to it and realized that she had also heard that same kind of scream before. She told him about when she was young, and lived in Juarez, Mexico (adjacent to El Paso) near the Rio Grande and old El Paso ASARCO copper smelting plant and how they (she and her friends) would have to cross an old revine to get home as kids. They would sometimes forget the time and wind up coming home in the dark. Her mother had warned them of the "creature" that was "going to get you" so to be home earlier than dark. On the way home one night she heard a scream which sounded like the scream Hector had showed her on the internet. She also remembers hearing the same noises from bed at night many times.
Part II - INTERVIEW REPORT by Dr. Bruce Cornet
Interview with Possible Bigfoot Witness
Date of Interview: 15 April 2004.
Interviewer: Dr. Bruce Cornet, Deputy Director of the National Institute for Discovery Science (NIDS), 4975 S. Polaris Ave., Las Vegas, NV 89118 (702-798-1700).
First Name: Edgar
Last Name: Ramos
Home Address: Las Vegas, NV
Home Phone: (withheld)
Email Address: (withheld)
First Name: Hector
Last Name: Valles
Phone Number (withheld)
Email Address: (withheld)
The Type of Incident: Screams or cries made by some
unknown animal that approached the tent of the witnesses and then moved away (Hector
Valles's description), while they were camping near Cloudcroft, NM.
Date of Incident: Late August 1995 (just before 26 August. Edgar remembered because 26 April is his birthday, and it was only a couple days or so before his birthday).
Time of Incident: Near Midnight, and definitely after they had gone to bed and Edgar was sound asleep. He did not check the time.
Weather Conditions: Chilly but not cold, due to higher altitude during the Summer. Hectar had told Edgar to bring a jacket, and although it was still hot in El Paso, he was glad he had brought a jacket. It had not been raining as far as he can recall. Being inside the tent, he did not know if it was cloudy or clear at the time of the incident.
Location of Incident: White Sands National Monument Area Campgrounds just north of Cloudcroft, NM (# 14 on map).
Topographic map of area around Cloudcroft, NM.
Description of Area of Incident: Edgar recalls Hector driving on NM State Road 244, turning into a campground, and parking near the main road. He also recalls pitching their tent within eyesight of Hector's car, and that the ground was relatively level (no slope or incline). There were a few other cars and campers at this site. It was forested with open areas for pitching tents and parking cars.
There are no known caves, mines, or abandoned shelters in the area. The nearest bodies of water are small to large lakes about 21-22 miles west near Alamogordo, NM. The area around Cloudcroft has many small ephemeral streams coming off numerous hills and small mountains.
No actual sighting of an animal was made by Edgar or by Hector. All they both heard were screaming sounds made by some unknown animal. Edgar says Hector woke him up out of a sound sleep, and being drowsy, he doesn't know how long he listened to the animal sounds, but it was for more than 10 screams.
Edgar said Hector kept saying, "Do you hear that?" and "What is it?" A sound similar to what Edgar says he heard can be found at www.angelfire.com/wa/sasquatchsearch/images/BIGFEET.wav. Edgar chose that particular sound after listening to several alleged Bigfoot sounds on that website.
Because he was not afraid, he went back to sleep. If the screams were consecutive without much time in between them as in the above recording, he listened for less than one minute before going back to sleep. He said he could have listened longer, but not much more than five minutes before falling asleep. Edgar said Hector appeared visibly upset and afraid, staid up past when he fell back to sleep, and the next morning told him more about what had happened. Edgar was not aware that the animal making the sounds came close to their tent. Nor was he aware of any strange odors. They did not examine the area for tracts, and they did not ask any of the other campers whether they had heard the screams that night. Edgar said Hector asked one of the park rangers about animals that screamed in the night, and the ranger said the area had many cougars that occasionally would make scream-like sounds (possibly females in heat).
The sound Edgar remembers hearing was not that of a cougar.
A cougar cry sounds like this: http://www.projectnoah.com/meira.htm.
A female cougar in heat sounds like this: http://www.cathouse-fcc.org/sounds/sandy.au.
A cougar snarl sounds like this: http://www.cathouse-fcc.org/sounds/butbut.au.
None are similar to the sounds allegedly coming from Bigfoot (www.angelfire.com/wa/sasquatchsearch/images/BIGFEET.wav). The sound Edgar says he heard is like the BIGFEET.wav linked above. Whatever this animal was, it was not a cougar. Its screaming as it approached, entered, and left the campsite (according to Hector) is unlike the behavior of any known wild animal, except one that might have been injured and in constant pain.
Bruce Cornet, Ph.D.
National Institute for Discovery Science
4975 S. Polaris Ave.
Las Vegas, NV 89118
Investigator comment from Sharon Eby (Cornet) and Dr. Bruce Cornet: Hector may not have been aware that Edgar fell back to sleep and thought he was still listening to the creature. Edgar stated he was very groggy and tired and soon fell asleep after hearing the initial screams.
Additional Investigators comment: Edgar stated he figured on hearing animals in the woods and did not feel threatened, however Hector was quite afraid and stayed awake until the creature had come through the camp and passed on by, fading into the distance. It is strange that Edgar, even though groggy, could sleep through such screams so close to the camp. (paranormal indicator similar to alleged alien abduction scenarios?)
Follow - up Pictures/Maps added by Sharon Eby 5/1/04
Lincoln National Forest sign showing Cloudcroft recreational area
Traveling from Alamogordo, NM towards Cloudcroft (desert terrain)
Moving closer toward Cloudcroft, NM (trees come into range)
Cloudcroft, NM area (pine trees are commonplace)
Pines Campground where alleged bigfoot was heard passing through
Unfortunately the campground was closed when I arrived 5/1/04
Front gate at Pines Campground, closed to the public (construction)
Panoramic view of campground area at front gate
Articles 2 Page
(c) Sharon (Eby) Cornet 2011